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Note 44.509 MOUNT-L 509 of 517 CUPIDO::STRITAR "Andrej Stritar, IJS,(61)-1885-450" 111 lines 16-JAN-1995 08:05 CUPIDO::STRITAR "Andrej Stritar, IJS,(61)-1885-450" 111 lines 16-JAN-1995 08:05 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: STENAR::STENAR::MRGATE::"X400::1=de::2=d400::3=tr::5=edu::4=metu::4=cc::4=knidos::6=mountainee To: CUPIDO::STRITAR CC: Subj: Re: RMI, risk, etc. From: FUNC: edu NAME: mountaineering <6=mountaineering@4=KNIDOS@4=CC@4=METU@5=EDU@3=TR@2=D400@1=DE@X400@STENAR> To: NAME: Multiple recipients of list FUNC: edu <6=mountaineering@4=KNIDOS@4=CC@4=METU@5=EDU@3=TR@2=D400@1=DE@X400@STENAR> RFC-822-HEADERS: Errors-To: metin@knidos.cc.metu.edu.tr Originator: mountaineering@knidos.cc.metu.edu.tr Precedence: bulk X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0c -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas Date: 13-Jan-1995 Posted-date: 13-Jan-1995 > I echo those who underscore need for follow up training after > one has been with RMI. .... > Ideally, one who is interested in alpine/glacier travel would > take a more thorough course rather than a one/two day training > that RMI provides. ..... > There is much more one needs to be a mountaineer, but I have > seen many who use opportunity (if summited) as bragging rights. > > Raymond Dong > Seattle WA > This is a good point. Taking an RMI course does not make you well versed mountaineer. In fact, taking many courses will not either, but it helps a lot. Mountaineering, like many pursuits takes a long time and many adventures to get reasonably competent at doing. Even with all the trips I have been on, I am only now becoming reasonably competent, and it's very few compared with many climbers I know. There are so many aspects of mountaineering, that it takes so many trips and so many years to "master" many of the skills, that IMHO, you can never become a master of mountaineering. You can not live long enough, if your job isn't a mountaineering instructor half the year and climbing bum the rest. I never stop learning things on every trip. If I don't learn something new I feel I missed something. The key is to take enough risk to have fun, enjoy, and learn, but not so much that you don't have fun, scare youself badly, injure, or kill yourself. The recent posting from Denise on climbing Mt. Silverheels is a good example. She was having fun, I suspect, evening battling the high winds to a point. Somewhere the trip got to be more than expected, and it became less fun and more scary, and eventually not fun. It became "I need to survive!". Denise, is this about right? The trick is to know when to turn back, change plans, etc., so that you don't get into trouble. That's where the experience of years of mountaineering come in. Something, I am only beginning to understand and appreciate. Then again, the trips I learn the most from are the ones that I scare myself on, so there is a fine line between to little and too much risk. You have to decide that yourself. Willie Hunt PS It has been brought to my attention that some feel I am often bragging in my posts. I have thought about this before many times, and yes I see how some posts can easily be viewed that way. That is not my intention, and if I come accross that way, I am sorry. I only try to relay enough detail so that others can understand what's going on and what my perspective is on the story. For example, in a recent post I mentioned that "I didn't have any trouble carrying a 90 pound pack up through slushy snow to Camp Muir" in the context of saying the one should be in top aerobic shape to climb Rainier. That may seem like bragging, but to me it's details. If someone told me that, that would tell me quite a bit about the terrain not being that difficult, and also put the persons willingness to carry load up 4500 feet, and that they are in shape, good shape! Also, by writing that I am trying to make a point about my perspective. It's from someone who is in top aerobic shape and thus says things are easy, when they may seem like grueling to others. If I told you I ran 8.0 miles yesterday in 58 minutes (which I did), I write that to illustrate what kind of shape I am in, not to brag, because that really isn't anything to brag about. The 2 other guys I ran with were at least 2 minutes ahead of me, and all of our times seem slow compared with a competitive runner. Look at it this way, a world class marathon runner runs a 5:10 mile for 25.6 miles, and I ran a 7:15 mile for less than a 1/3 of that. With a bunch of training, I still doubt seriously if I could run a marathon at a 7:15 pace. It's all a matter of perspective. PPS Also, something I have noticed about climbers and pack weights is that they don't weigh them. I often do, but didn't before Rainier. I just started stuffing all sorts of stuff into my Geogory Denali until it was full. I picked it up and thought gee, this seems a bit heavy but it's not that bad. On the way back down I realized that the pack (even with less food in it), was really quite heavy, so after the trip I weighed it at 89.2 lbs without the eaten food. If you don't weigh in your pack, try it sometime. You may be surprised at how much it really weighs. Also, strip and weigh yourself, then put on full extreme weather gear with accessories (IE double boots, crampons, long underwear, full Gore-Tex shell, expd. mitts, balacava, goggles, holding a mountain axe) and weigh again. Care to guess how many pounds? Just for fun add full tech gear for glacier travel and fix line ascent and repeat. It's no wonder mountaineers crawl up the mountain. I should just do it in running shoes and running shorts.
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